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Posted by Sharlee (203.45.206.21) on May 01, 2002 at 08:42:03:

In Reply to: Hello posted by Z.B. (64.80.132.235) on April 30, 2002 at 17:55:08:

#### Riso's theories have a compelling pattern to them although I am not sure myself of their validity with regard to parental types and connections. I would like to see a study with regard to people's types and their parent orientation. The way I understand his theory that it is only either one parent or both parents collectively who influence the type. That is, if you are orientated towards the father, your relationship with your mother is not relevant to the theory and vice versa. In your example, a person who is ambivalent to the mother and disconnected (negative?) from the father would mean that the person is an 8 if they are primarily orientated towards the mother and a one if the dominant orientation is towards the father. If they are orientated towards both parents, it is the collective relationship with both parents (either positive, negative or ambivalent) which determines the type. There would not be a different orientation towards either parent in that situation. As a 1 myself, I have a close relationship with my mother and a distant relationship with my father (now dead). However, despite my distant relationship with my father, I feel/felt something akin to him, a connectedness so to speak. Perhaps this is a genetic recognition, I don't know. It is interesting that the movement towards integration of personality goes from negative both parents (4) to negative father (1)to negative mother (7) to ambivalent both parents (5) to ambivalent mother (8) to ambivalent father (2). Its almost like the healing process goes slowly from being alienated from both parents to then alienated from only one parent, then the other, then progressing to ambivalent etc. There is not however a crossover to the positive experiences (3, 6, 9) which circle in their own orbit so to speak. It would be neat to find a rational progression for the integrating types and to understand how our personalities are "healed". However despite many years of thinking about it, I haven't been able to satisfy myself of such an explanation. Sharlee

: I am a newbie to the Enneagram, so perhaps someone who is knowledgable can help me here. After reading Riso's book, I strongly identified with type Six, and with Five Eight and One in close second. A possible nickname for my type: The Debator.

: But Riso's description of parental orientation is unclear. First of all, by "disconnected" to a parent, does Riso mean DISLIKING that parent at an early age, or simply did not identifing (i.e. see yourself in) that parent? Or does he mean that you did not have much of a relationship, good or bad, with that them at all?

: And some of the overlap in orientations is confusing. Say you were ambivelent to the mother, but disconnected from the father. Does this result in a ype One, a Type Eight, a Nine (inbetween), a One with an Eight wing, etc.? Any helpful responses would be--helpful! (and much appreciated)

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Re: Hello Mikko (193.234.247.51) 03:36:56 05/02/02 (0)

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: #### Riso's theories have a compelling pattern to them although I am not sure myself of their validity with regard to parental types and connections. I would like to see a study with regard to people's types and their parent orientation. The way I understand his theory that it is only either one parent or both parents collectively who influence the type. That is, if you are orientated towards the father, your relationship with your mother is not relevant to the theory and vice versa. In your example, a person who is ambivalent to the mother and disconnected (negative?) from the father would mean that the person is an 8 if they are primarily orientated towards the mother and a one if the dominant orientation is towards the father. If they are orientated towards both parents, it is the collective relationship with both parents (either positive, negative or ambivalent) which determines the type. There would not be a different orientation towards either parent in that situation. As a 1 myself, I have a close relationship with my mother and a distant relationship with my father (now dead). However, despite my distant relationship with my father, I feel/felt something akin to him, a connectedness so to speak. Perhaps this is a genetic recognition, I don't know. It is interesting that the movement towards integration of personality goes from negative both parents (4) to negative father (1)to negative mother (7) to ambivalent both parents (5) to ambivalent mother (8) to ambivalent father (2). Its almost like the healing process goes slowly from being alienated from both parents to then alienated from only one parent, then the other, then progressing to ambivalent etc. There is not however a crossover to the positive experiences (3, 6, 9) which circle in their own orbit so to speak. It would be neat to find a rational progression for the integrating types and to understand how our personalities are "healed". However despite many years of thinking about it, I haven't been able to satisfy myself of such an explanation. Sharlee : : I am a newbie to the Enneagram, so perhaps someone who is knowledgable can help me here. After reading Riso's book, I strongly identified with type Six, and with Five Eight and One in close second. A possible nickname for my type: The Debator. : : But Riso's description of parental orientation is unclear. First of all, by "disconnected" to a parent, does Riso mean DISLIKING that parent at an early age, or simply did not identifing (i.e. see yourself in) that parent? Or does he mean that you did not have much of a relationship, good or bad, with that them at all? : : And some of the overlap in orientations is confusing. Say you were ambivelent to the mother, but disconnected from the father. Does this result in a ype One, a Type Eight, a Nine (inbetween), a One with an Eight wing, etc.? Any helpful responses would be--helpful! (and much appreciated)

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