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Enneagram Type 5 Board Archive Re: ContextPosted by Margaret on November 20, 2000 at 20:48:42: In Reply to: Context posted by Rotten Apple on November 20, 2000 at 19:53:08: : Margaret, : I'm glad you still have the patience to respond to me but as you may suppose, I'm not interested in a moral lesson. (Particularly from one who can't even spell out the word "sex" like an embarrassed 12 year old.) ***It has to do with maintaining 'manners', 'high moral standards' - as opposed to embarrassment. I don't sound very attractive nor lady-like when I cuss (or talk 'dirty'). I sound better keeping my language in check. It also makes me feel cleaner and better about myself, too. But perhaps on the topic of manners, we can set out differences aside for some useful discussion? : I agree that knowing how to use social rules and etiquette is important for a variety of reasons. But in the case of the type 5, I would say those reasons have more to do with handling the other person than with one's personal morality. ***Agree. Depends on what you want from or to do with that person and how best to keep the respect between you 2 for the time being - and/or protect yourself (and your interests) without losing them (hurting them). (Yes, I know how to be perfectly polite in the proper context. That is what makes me a dangerous devil.) : How do you feel about the adaptability of social standards. Do you think one must always adhere to their own set of manners (stick to your guns) or should behavior be altered to suit the environment (when in Rome)? ***Again, it all has to do with what I would gain or risk losing by selecting either choice. And usually when you want something (such as earning people's good will, or good reputation - that alwys comes in handy on a rainy day), it's usually better to adapt/ alter your behaviour to the other people whose help/aid/goodwill you never know when someday you might need it. We are not islands. No man is an island - although I have lived like that throughout a large segment of my 20s - in the end -you find out you cannot possibly live out in the world all on your very own for very long - someday, somewhere - you're going to find yourself depeleted of all resources, all goodwill, all potential sources of help - believe me - I've tried it - I was the 'ultimate 5 par excellence' for years - I know what it's like to be alone - live alone- survive alone- I'm not saying it cannot be done - it can - but the human environment we live in today - it's very difficult to live in complete isolation as much as possible today - to live somehwere remote - there is bound to be other human laws and law enforcers lurking somewhere enforcing it- we can only 'escape' society so much- only go so far - also - even more so - what makes it even more difficult further yet - is the human heart - we can live in isolation from family and friends and love for only so long - after complete deprivation for about 5-10 yrs - we 'cave in' - we yearn, seek, need to what is essential and fundamental to sustaining our human lives ultimately - that is - to be with other people - that also means - civilized society -
What if it were a Middle Eastern country where propriety requires woman to cover all but hands and eyes... would you adapt without argument? : To sum up... if manners are culturally derived and values internally derived, how do you balance a conflict between them? ***By figuring out what actin or behaviour would give me the most benefits and peace (or happiness) with the least problems and annoyances in that particular situation - both long-term and short-term - unfortunately I am still too quick to react negatively when I feel insulted or something - I still need much more work counting to 10 before I speak, ok, make that 100, no 1000 - : RA
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