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Re: Emotional honesty & E1s

Re: Emotional honesty & E1s

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Posted by Christy on August 27, 1998 at 10:25:24:

In Reply to: Re: Emotional honesty & E1s posted by Hal on August 26, 1998 at 09:50:22:

: : : : How do you get emotional honesty from a 1? Geenius?

: : : Speaking only for myself: Ask us.

: : : Seriously, a lot of people just default to thinking that we don't have any
: : : feelings at all, so they never get around to bothering to ask us what they
: : : might be. The fact that we may not VOLUNTEER our feelings doesn't mean we
: : : don't have them. It doesn't mean we don't care whether they're taken into
: : : consideration. It just means we don't trust them as much as we trust our
: : : reasoning. Like everyone else, we want to put our best face forward, and
: : : in our case, we consider our best face to be our sense of right and wrong,
: : : not our sense of fuzzy and prickly.

: : I know that my mother does have feelings, obviously they are strong enough to get hurt often - but the detachment from everyone else's emotional welfare is what I'm concerned about. I learned early on that I was to control my feelings or be ostracized. Ex. Last summer my teenage brother was preparing for first year of college. He ended up dumping on me (screaming, cussing, hitting things, etc.) I ended up taking my 3 y.o. and leaving the house. THroughout all this my mother watched and did nothing except tell me when I left the house that I obviously did not care or love anyone in my family (because I was leaving the scene).
: : By leaving and saying calmly that I was not going to partake in this (it wasn't an argument), I rocked the boat and was not spoken to by anyone in my family for 9 months. 9. During this time I receved many letters saying that it was my fault, I had no business being there, I was infringing on their space, a list of everything bad I've ever done in my life, etc. etc. etc. Needless to say I didn't answer the letters.
: : I need to make a decision to either stay within my family's reach and not rock the boat, or cut off ties. This kind of crap hurts deeply and to be truthful I'm sick of it and do not want to be a doormat anymore. But for me to change anything means to confront my mother with the awful truth that their lives might be a little "dysfunctional" and they need help. She doesn't believe in "help" or "psychology" or "personality traits", or anything that I trust in. It means slamming my head against a brick wall. So I dream of spiders and cobwebs all night long and try to change what I can in my world as much as possible.

: Christy,

: I had no idea. I'm sorry this happened to you.

: But you really have hit the nail on the head in terms of answering the original question of this thread--you can't force someone to change or even to see the truth about themselves. And unhealthy 1's can be especially resistant. They have an overpowering sense of right and wrong, in the sense that they are right, and anyone who disagrees with them is wrong. They are terrified of taking a good, hard look at themselves out of fear that they will find that they have been living life the wrong way all along; they couldn't deal with that. So the objectivity of a healthy 1 goes out the window in favor of stubbornness and blaming others for any and all problems.

: My father is an unhealthy 1w9. I have had similar difficulty communicating with him and getting him to understand me or see my point of view. I haven't spoken to him in over 2 years because I've been so angry at his utter lack of compassion for the way he treated me as a child, and the fact that I'm now 27 and he still tries to treat me as a child.

: I wish I had a better solution to share, but mine has been the same as yours--just avoid the unchangeable family conflicts that still haunt me from time to time, and do the best I can to improve myself. My world also remains separate from most of my family, and the two can't seem to exist together in harmony. They either collide violently, or just drift apart.

: - Hal -

Wow. Isn't that so strange - we're the same age.
I hope to God that some day it might change. It seems so sad that for me to go to my biological home it costs me my health. My mother treats me like a child too - which is irrational considering the many temper tantrums I've seen her have over the years. When I buckled last Christmas and went to my therapist for advice on handling the strain of being cut off from my family we got to one central point. My feelings on the situation is that if I can't help my family - how can I help others? She said very strongly - "You can't help anyone that does not want help - they're telling you over and over that they can't handle it, back off and try to have whatever relationship you can with them." When my mother made the effort to talk to me - I was there. Of course it helped that the flu had overcome me at the time. But still.....what Brian said is the most vital point...... to go to a thinker stance (1) I have to come to terms w/my mother. I don't know what that means for me yet although I've struggled w/it for so long.

Follow Ups:

Re: Emotional honesty & E1s Hal 08:05:11 8/28/98 (6)
- Re: Emotional honesty & E1s Christy 12:54:12 8/28/98 (5)
  - Re: Emotional honesty & E1s Ann 14:03:12 8/30/98 (4)
    - Re: Emotional honesty & E1s Hal 08:06:57 8/31/98 (3)
      - Re: Emotional honesty & E1s Christy 14:50:38 8/31/98 (2)
        
        Re: Emotional honesty & E1s Ann 00:51:06 9/01/98 (1)
        
        Re: Emotional honesty & E1s Christy 11:10:02 9/01/98 (0)

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: : : : : How do you get emotional honesty from a 1? Geenius? : : : : Speaking only for myself: Ask us. : : : : Seriously, a lot of people just default to thinking that we don't have any : : : : feelings at all, so they never get around to bothering to ask us what they : : : : might be. The fact that we may not VOLUNTEER our feelings doesn't mean we : : : : don't have them. It doesn't mean we don't care whether they're taken into : : : : consideration. It just means we don't trust them as much as we trust our : : : : reasoning. Like everyone else, we want to put our best face forward, and : : : : in our case, we consider our best face to be our sense of right and wrong, : : : : not our sense of fuzzy and prickly. : : : I know that my mother does have feelings, obviously they are strong enough to get hurt often - but the detachment from everyone else's emotional welfare is what I'm concerned about. I learned early on that I was to control my feelings or be ostracized. Ex. Last summer my teenage brother was preparing for first year of college. He ended up dumping on me (screaming, cussing, hitting things, etc.) I ended up taking my 3 y.o. and leaving the house. THroughout all this my mother watched and did nothing except tell me when I left the house that I obviously did not care or love anyone in my family (because I was leaving the scene). : : : By leaving and saying calmly that I was not going to partake in this (it wasn't an argument), I rocked the boat and was not spoken to by anyone in my family for 9 months. 9. During this time I receved many letters saying that it was my fault, I had no business being there, I was infringing on their space, a list of everything bad I've ever done in my life, etc. etc. etc. Needless to say I didn't answer the letters. : : : I need to make a decision to either stay within my family's reach and not rock the boat, or cut off ties. This kind of crap hurts deeply and to be truthful I'm sick of it and do not want to be a doormat anymore. But for me to change anything means to confront my mother with the awful truth that their lives might be a little "dysfunctional" and they need help. She doesn't believe in "help" or "psychology" or "personality traits", or anything that I trust in. It means slamming my head against a brick wall. So I dream of spiders and cobwebs all night long and try to change what I can in my world as much as possible. : : Christy, : : I had no idea. I'm sorry this happened to you. : : But you really have hit the nail on the head in terms of answering the original question of this thread--you can't force someone to change or even to see the truth about themselves. And unhealthy 1's can be especially resistant. They have an overpowering sense of right and wrong, in the sense that they are right, and anyone who disagrees with them is wrong. They are terrified of taking a good, hard look at themselves out of fear that they will find that they have been living life the wrong way all along; they couldn't deal with that. So the objectivity of a healthy 1 goes out the window in favor of stubbornness and blaming others for any and all problems. : : My father is an unhealthy 1w9. I have had similar difficulty communicating with him and getting him to understand me or see my point of view. I haven't spoken to him in over 2 years because I've been so angry at his utter lack of compassion for the way he treated me as a child, and the fact that I'm now 27 and he still tries to treat me as a child. : : I wish I had a better solution to share, but mine has been the same as yours--just avoid the unchangeable family conflicts that still haunt me from time to time, and do the best I can to improve myself. My world also remains separate from most of my family, and the two can't seem to exist together in harmony. They either collide violently, or just drift apart. : : - Hal - : Wow. Isn't that so strange - we're the same age. : I hope to God that some day it might change. It seems so sad that for me to go to my biological home it costs me my health. My mother treats me like a child too - which is irrational considering the many temper tantrums I've seen her have over the years. When I buckled last Christmas and went to my therapist for advice on handling the strain of being cut off from my family we got to one central point. My feelings on the situation is that if I can't help my family - how can I help others? She said very strongly - "You can't help anyone that does not want help - they're telling you over and over that they can't handle it, back off and try to have whatever relationship you can with them." When my mother made the effort to talk to me - I was there. Of course it helped that the flu had overcome me at the time. But still.....what Brian said is the most vital point...... to go to a thinker stance (1) I have to come to terms w/my mother. I don't know what that means for me yet although I've struggled w/it for so long.

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