Posted by Ronnie on August 01, 1999 at 10:12:19:
In Reply to: Re: Empathy = fear + identification? Wrong !!!!! posted by Tal on August 01, 1999 at 07:33:58:
Tal, Andy said he didn't want to argue so much about you why you're wrong, because he just feels so. His opinion, your opinion is different, so what?
A neat way of driving a five nuts, by denying intellectual debate and talk about feelings alone. :)
I feel much like Andy--argumenting about your opinions feels like a drag. To me it's just because it seems the contexts behind ideas are theoretical and detach from real-life experience. The feelings caused by theories aren't much when compared to real-life experience, and when having a strong feeling function, talking about abstract theories isn't too natural to me. Anyway, some commets of mine follow.
The empathy of twos *is* real, the reasons behind it may wary, but what is is. In your opinion it could be claimed that the thinking function of unhealthy fives is just an illusion as well. In my opinion it's not, the ideas might be warped and strange, but still result of genuine thinking.
I think what Andy was trying to say was if you'd try to emulate a two, you'd be afraid of the intense emotions flowing all over you. Btw, I don't identify stronger with something that "could happen to me". I think it's a sixish trait.
"all emotions are at root reactions to intellectual assessments"
Do I sense something like "emotions are for lesser beings" here? In any case, I find it more than a tad amazing that you first comment someone's opinion of empathy (being connected to the world) and in the next sentence you ask that person to state his opinion of empathy! You sure you're relaxed?
"You're probably a very emotional person. It's hardly surprising that an emotional person empathizes more than a relatively unemotional one does. But don't let yourself be fooled into believing you're actually feeling what they feel. What you feel is a reaction to the knowledge that it could be you instead of them. Otherwise why don't you feel an identical response for someone who suffers a misfortune three continents away as you do for someone in your neighbourhood you don't know?"
Why do you insist everyone feels and thinks the way you do? I don't feel more empathy towards someone victim of "what could've happened to me". That's a sixish reaction to potential threats in the surroundings. I feel most empathy towards people who acknowledge they aren't perfect and are burdened by their perceived or true faults. They are in the need of caring and nurturing and usually I have a personal contact to them. I don't feel much empathy to someone I'm never in contact with, no matter if s/he is a block or a continent away.
You *can* feel what another person is feeling.
Ronnie